Times of Israel Ops & Blogs editor Miriam Herschlag, Ohad Zeltzer-Zubida and Noah Efron discuss three topics of incomparable importance and end with an anecdote about something in Israel that made them smile this week.
If It Please the Court
Is it time for Israeli courts to stop allowing improperly gotten evidence? A newly proposed law would outlaw “the fruit of the poisonous tree.”
Gold
What do the Olympics tell folks here about what it means to be an Israeli?
Under Another Sun
What does an award-winning documentary about growing up on a kibbutz tell us about what it means to be an Israeli?
Your Only Choice Is Zionism Or Anti-Zionism. Which One Do You Choose?
For our most unreasonably generous Patreon supporters, in our extra-special, special extra discussion, we discuss an essay in Tablet by Liel Liebovitz called, “Us & Them: Your only two choices are Zionism and Anti-Zionism, Pick Wisely”, asking: Are those really our only two choices? Can’t we be Yiddishists? Can’t we be Vegans or Kantians or Olivia Rodrigo fans?
All that and Yoni Poliker!
Songs
- Sof Shavua
- At lo Ani
- Murphy
- Pashut lo Normali
I haven’t watched the doc movie Children of the Sun, though I would very much like to and hope to one day actually do this.
But, based on Noah’s description of it, I, as a psychotherapist for the past 26 years in private practice, agree whole heartedly with his analysis about the tragedy of the reality of the idea of the בית ילדים. Now, we’ll stipulate that things are not exclusively binary, that most things , if not all, are neither all or none, but are rather a mix of the two.
After reading several book on the subject, especially those dealing with the long term impact of this system of child rearing, as well as treating several Israelis who were native born kibbutzniks, who were brought up in that era within that system, brutality and cruelty, was not only perpetrated by the children, but also by the caregivers and was overwhelmingly endemic, prevalent, under reported and undealt with.
In the kibbutz, the well accepted concept of the need for early solid attachment to a consistently available caregiver, was turned on its head, for the sake of implementing a socialistic, idealistic philosophy, leaving children to fend for themselves to develop a well rounded and stable sense of self able to attach, in return, to other people they can trust to be there for them always and forever (a slight exaggeration, of course….)
Miriam’s mention of separation as a task that all children must learn to deal with in a healthy way is correct, but the brutality of the early separation (immediately after the experience of the symbiosis of being connected for 9 months in-utero) the parade of ever changing caregivers, the (rejecting) the coldness of the parents themselves (self selected people who chose this sort of child rearing method) combined to leave deep wounds clustering around issues of abandonment, low self worth, fear of rejection, difficulties with and in adult relationships, etc.
There were certainly some good outcomes to kibbutz childhood experiences, that is, if you are in pursuit of creating a new Sparta: people who can suffer in silence, suppress their feelings, sacrifice their individual strivings in favor of national goals and needs, etc.
Thank you for your discussion and I LOVE THE PROGRAM. Every Thursday is a better day for me when I listen to your voices delivering all the puns, irony, sarcasm, serious takes on politics and especially any of the cultural and lifestyle news you bring to me, here in the Village of Palmetto Bay, in the greater Miami-Dade County, FL., on my 3 Mile morning walk, in this hot, humid tropical paradise!!!!
Very enjoyable show. Keep up the great work you do.